(upbeat music)
-(Narrator) Welcome to The Accessible Learning Experience
where we help you turn learning barriers
into learning opportunities.
On this episode, we're joined
by Carson Cochran and Somer Smith
to discuss their state-district partnership in Georgia.
Carson is a program manager
for the Georgia Department Of Education
and Somer's an assistive technology specialist
from Marietta City Schools.
Georgia is one of seven states participating
in the National AEM cohort.
With technical assistance
and support from the National AEM Center,
cohort states bring together state level leaders
and leaders from three to five selected school districts
to develop coordinated systems for the timely
provision of high quality accessible educational materials
and technologies for all learners,
especially students who need them due to disability.
Carson and Somer share some
of the lessons they've learned as their partnership
in Georgia has grown, and stay tuned to the end
to learn about an exciting IEP initiative, Take A Minute.
Now let's turn to our conversation
with Carson and Somer.
- (Luis) Welcome Carson and Somer.
So great to have you on the podcast.
We are so excited to have this conversation with you.
So we'll go ahead and jump right into it, so Somer,
tell us a little bit about yourself and your experiences
supporting learners who use accessible materials
and technologies.
Is there an experience
that stands out in shaping your approach to this work?
- (Somer) Great question, Luis.
I'm Somer Smith, the assistive technology specialist
in Marietta City School District in Georgia.
My background is in speech language pathology,
and I've always had a passion
for students who use AAC communication devices,
because I feel like everyone needs to have a voice,
but I did have an experience with my daughter who has
a diagnosis of dyslexia and trying to get the
accessible materials that she needed
in school to be successful
and going through the IEP process as a parent,
kind of opened my eyes to a lot of the needs
that our students do have.
And I have since had a career change
from speech language pathology into assistive technology
so I could help more families through the process and make
it a little bit easier for them to get the accessible
educational materials that they need.
- (Luis) Thanks for sharing that personal experience Somer
for so many of us, it is personal.
That's what brings us into this work.
So I really appreciate that, and Carson,
how about you, how did you get started in this work?
What's your why for accessible materials and technologies?
- (Carson) >Hi, I'm Carson Cochran.
I am the program manager of the Georgia Instructional
Materials Center with the Georgia Department Of Education.
I'm here as a representative of the state and part of
a very exciting cohort
of seven states that are participating
in a four year process to improve state-wide support
for districts in the acquisition
and implementation of accessible technologies
and accessible educational materials.
Luis, I have kind of the same path as Somer.
I'm a speech language pathologist
and worked extensively with children.
In K through 12 and actually adults who were non-verbal.
And I'm reminded of an experience
that I had when I was relatively new to the field.
And I'm trying to do an evaluation on a non-verbal student
with cerebral palsy and the communication system
that I was using had a kind of an evaluation package
built into it, being new, that's all I knew to do.
So I was trying to add,
and I was asking him questions to identify
and touch objects, and then it came to the reading part.
This was a high school student who is extremely bright,
but I realized he couldn't read.
And part of the reason that he couldn't read was
because he had never interacted with text independently.
It was always read to him or he had been guided
through it and he lacked the independence of being able
to read and I never will forget that experience,
and just the look on his face and the embarrassment
on both our faces of me asking him
to do something that he couldn't do and him not being able
to read and he should have been able to.
- (Luis) And that's the goal, right,
is to bring about that independence and autonomy.
So I can definitely appreciate that.
Thank you for sharing that experience, Carson.
So we know that teamwork is so important to making sure that
students who need accessible materials and technologies
can get them in a timely manner and are able
to use them to support their learning.
We know that it's important to bring together a team
that can provide different perspectives to this work.
Can you give the audience a sense
of how you're building such a system in Georgia, Carson?
What does that team look like?
Who is on your state team and what are their roles?
- (Carson) It's kind of funny, when we were applying for this cohort,
I had two active applications going at the same time,
trying to figure out who the best person was on the team.
And I have a lot of input
from various individuals in the state,
reached out to folks at CAST to try
to guide me through the situation, but what I found
is that there are key components that are required, right,
to participate in the cohort.
And some of those we've pulled in,
we've got instructional technology, curriculum folks,
we've got school and district effectiveness,
assistive technology.
We went out beyond what we were expected to have.
We pulled in some pre-service teachers
in the university systems, and then we also participate
with the folks that have the Tech Act grant.
But what really happens is that our team is very fluid.
And so what we've really been doing is pulling in
the skills of people across the DOE,
also other organizations to learn more as we come up
on things that, you know,
we're really not sure how to navigate.
We reach out to those in those specific fields
to get more information,
to help us put the package together, if you will.
And I think these connections have also benefited us
as a department, as a valuable resource,
because what we're doing at the DOE
is becoming more mindful about accessibility
of all the materials that we're producing,
whether they're print materials, video materials,
or even if we're just doing face-to-face
trainings or supports,
we want accessibility to be built into everything
that we do, and I think that's a huge growth offset
of this cohort project.
And it's a great benefit.
- (Luis) Love to hear that, Carson,
that it's building that awareness
of accessibility that's extending beyond this work.
And now I know that you're also working
with districts like Somer's,
so tell us a little bit about that.
- (Luis) Well, I always laugh because of Somer's experience
which she'll tell you about in a little while,
I can imagine we'll touch on that, but you know,
it's important for us at the state
to reach out and work with districts
in the support because districts are the
boots on the ground, interacting with the students.
And so, you know what we want
to offer to the districts that we're working with.
And we have three cohort districts that we're working with
and they're in different sizes and different demographics,
so that we can really look at a balance of what we're doing.
But what we want to do is offer support
to the excellence that's going on in the districts already
and providing them tools to implement accessibility
in materials and technologies.
And I'll talk about it in just in just a minute
to really implement an initiative that we've got brewing.
And I think number two, you know,
it's that we're gaining important information
about what the process looks like at a local level.
And so we can share those processes throughout the state
to benefit not only the three districts
that we're working with
but every district in the state of Georgia.
- (Luis) Somer, Carson kind of hinted at your experience
when you were asked to join this partnership.
So can you tell us a little bit about that
and what that was like?
- (Somer) Sure, to be honest, when we got the call from the state,
I was a little nervous because I thought that meant we were
in trouble or we had done something wrong and we had been
working so hard to make changes in our district
that then I was like, oh no, what have we done?
But then he assured me that it's a good thing,
we're not in trouble,
that since we had been trying to make some changes,
we were more of a district that they were looking for.
So our district is a very small district.
We are an inner city district,
but we have a very diverse population
from very affluent families to very low economic status.
We have a lot of students who have multiple languages
within their homes.
So what that means for our district is we have a lot
of needs for the accessible materials.
So once we started with this cohort with the state,
we were so excited and realized that we were not
in trouble and that, so it's actually a great opportunity.
So I think it was fun for Carson because he just saw this
as a great opportunity for everyone.
He didn't realize how it would look
at our level and that we were like, oh no, what did we do?
So that part was kind of interesting.
Once we started with the Pilot though,
that was kind of eye-opening for us because we realized we
did not have all of the people that we needed at the table.
We started our Pilot with the special ed director,
the assistive technology specialist,
the director of instructional technology,
and then we did have a parent on the team as well,
and I believe a representative from special education.
Once we left our first meeting with our tasks
on how we could improve some of our procedures,
we realized that we needed to add a lot more people
to our team because we could really make
some proactive changes in our district.
So now our team to look at accessible educational materials
includes the chief of special student services
and the executive director of academic achievement,
the technology and innovation coordinator,
a vision impaired teacher,
a DHH, deaf hard of hearing teacher, a general education,
special education, parent,
and the director of all of our media specialists.
So we have a lot of people who are now working together
to make some changes in Marietta City,
and we are super excited about it.
- (Luis) So you've really rounded out your team, and again,
brought in different perspectives because they're all
important in making sure that this work takes place
in a coordinated, collaborative way.
So that's excellent, and to Carson's point, you know,
you're mirroring some of the work that's going on
at the state level, like Carson said,
you are the boots on the ground,
so the state can get your perspective
of what's going on to inform their practices.
And then you can also learn from the state level
by being able to get that information
about what's going on across the state.
So this is a great partnership and a really exciting way
to approach the work.
So Somer, what are some of your priorities
that you're working on at the district level,
can you tell us a little bit about that?
- (Somer) Yeah, our first priority that we focused on
was the procurement process.
We in participating with the state realized
that we did not have the correct language
for accessible educational materials in a lot of our RFPs,
and that was sort of alarming to us.
So we have now the language available.
And then when we went to put it
in all of our procurement documents,
we realized we had an even bigger problem
because the way our district is
is each school has a varying level of independence,
meaning that the administration of that building can choose
the curriculums or the additional educational resources
that are appropriate for that building.
And like I had said before,
we have varying needs across the district.
So one building may have a very high bilingual population
and may need some different resources than another school.
So in that we have a lot of different types of resources
that are brought into our schools and all of those resources
are not necessarily accessible to all of our learners.
And the administration in each of the buildings was not aware
that this language needed to be in those procurement
procedures because it's not anything
they had ever had to deal with before.
And anything that it was purchased for the whole district,
we had an awareness at the central office level,
but in the independent schools,
that awareness was not there.
So it opened our eyes to a lot of things that we needed
to do within our district to make some improvements.
And so from that, we now have some administrative guidance
that is being worked on right now that will go out
to all of the administrators,
so if they do buy materials specific for their school,
they would know what language would need to be in that
procurement document to make sure that it is accessible
for all of our learners.
So that's been our primary focus so far,
and then our next focus is really on the timeliness of it.
And just making sure that our students are getting
that at the same time as everyone else.
- (Luis) Thanks so much for sharing, Somer.
That procurement piece so important.
The more that we can do to be proactive
and to have accessibility being included
as part of that procurement process,
the more successful we'll be
because we're ensuring accessibility
is considered from the start for all learners
in the materials and the technology that we acquire.
So great work there, so keep that going.
Carson, how about for you?
What are some, as you work with the districts,
what are some of the priorities that you're focusing on
at the state level?
- (Carson) Like we said earlier, we're mirroring,
I think the districts are mirroring
what we're doing and vice versa.
What Somer was explaining is not isolated
just to her district, you know,
I work at the Georgia Instructional Materials Center
and almost daily,
we're getting requests for materials to be put into braille
or large print or digital
because they're not already done so
at the district level, when they're purchasing these things.
So, you know, that's the biggest thing.
We used to be a state where there was
a list that was approved that aligned to the curriculum.
About three or four years ago,
we went away from that so that all districts
can basically choose the curriculum that aligns
to the standards for what's best for the district.
So it kind of opened things up, so there's
no longer a finite list of things to make accessible.
It's kind of like the world is your oyster, if you will.
So it is very difficult.
And we're just trying to raise awareness across the state
at the district level to make sure that whenever a district
or local school is purchasing or acquiring, you know,
maybe free materials, that they are accessible
for every student in the building and the district,
so that all students have access to that material,
like all the others.
- (Luis) Somer you had shared a story with us
in a previous conversation that kind of brings
all of these things together, you know,
in relation to the timeliness of the materials.
And this is another component that's important
is the parent voice in all of this.
Can you share that story with us, Somer?
- (Somer) Yes, this one was kind of eye-opening,
a little bit of a hard pill for us to swallow,
but it's one of those things,
you know better and you do better.
So we are one of the three districts in the state
of Georgia that is part of this cohort for the state.
And so we were the only district to add a parent
to our panel for the first meeting.
And they were explaining everything
that we would be doing throughout this process.
And she was very quiet
through all of it, very happy to be part of the meeting.
And then as soon as that meeting ended,
she gave me a call and wanted to set up a meeting.
So one of the topics that was discussed in the first cohort
meeting was about the timeliness of accessible educational
materials and how we really need to have those materials
in the students' hands
as the same day as their general education peers.
And that really rang a bell for her because her son
who is now in second grade this year, he'll be
in third grade, has never had his reading material,
which needs to be enlarged at the same time
as his gen ed peers ever in his educational experience.
And he's been with our district the whole time.
And so that broke my heart a little bit
because it was one of those things, we did not know
that was happening at the central office level.
We knew that things were being ordered,
but since everything at each school
is so individual with our district,
things were happening and he was getting what he needed,
but he was not getting it at the correct time.
So we have corrected all of that.
He had everything he needed to start this school year
on time, but we didn't have a written process for that.
And so that the timely manner,
we now have a written process for
how to get the enlargements and braille and if needed,
but that one, I would really encourage any states
who are going to go through this process,
please add a parent because they bring
a whole different perspective.
It's sometimes not easy to hear,
but if we want to do right by the kids
in our district, we really need to hear that information.
So even though it was kind
of hard to hear, it was very good
for us, and we made the changes that we needed,
and we were able to make those very quickly.
We just weren't aware at the district office level that
that was happening.
- (Luis) And you bring up a great point, Somer.
Sometimes you need to hear some
of that information where it's not working,
because that's the only way that you're going
to be able to correct it.
So it's important to get that information
and then be able to take action on it.
So you point to a great lesson
about including that parent voice, because they can provide
that information that maybe you don't get at in other ways.
So what are some other lessons you would share
with another state in your case, Carson,
or with another district, Somer?
What are one or two lessons that you would share
from your experience so far being involved
in this kind of partnership?
- (Luis) Well, I really like what Somer said, you know,
when you know better, you do better.
It's difficult to change,
and it's difficult to look at yourself and honestly look
back and you know, with the parents' perspective,
we all see things differently,
and we all have those different experiences
that we bring to the table.
So you know,
it's so important to include all of those people.
Like I said earlier, I think in the first statement was,
you know, our stakeholder group has,
it's fluid, it moves in and out, depending on the needs
of the work that we're doing, we have in Georgia,
a system of continuous improvement.
And that system revolves around the whole student.
And what we're gaining from this cohort is, you know,
that realistic look of where we are as a state,
how we're providing supports to a district,
talking to the districts and finding out, you know,
where we're lacking in different aspects
of things from their perspective,
and then trying to put plans in place
that support districts throughout the state to help
continually improve and to know better
so that we can do better.
One of the things that have really benefited us are
the Quality Indicators of accessible educational materials,
because they align perfectly
with our system of continuous improvement.
It's really taking a look at what you're doing,
examining, finding out where those gaps are,
and then helping set goals to improve around the work that
that's already in motion, I would give a big shout out
to using those quality indicators
and accessible educational material Pilot,
which is a tool that CAST has to really help put things
into perspective for not only local districts,
but states as well.
- (Luis) We appreciate that shout out to the AEM Pilot,
which is like Carson said,
it's a tool that states and districts can use to self-assess
and continue to monitor their progress against the Quality
Indicators for the Provision
of Accessible Educational Materials and Technologies.
So thanks for that shoutout, Carson.
And Somer, how about you?
What is one or two lessons that you would share
with someone else, another district, for instance?
- (Somer) I think the main thing that I would share
is that if you have the opportunity to participate
in a pilot with your state level representatives,
I think you should definitely do it.
And the main reason I feel that way is I would not have
been able to get all of these team members around a table
to discuss accessible educational materials
had it not been for this pilot.
We know that there might've been some holes
in some of the procedures,
but I am not able to pull all of those people together
had I not had the backing
from the state, where I could come back
and say, Hey, these are the changes that need to be made.
And this is who we're participating with, and this is why,
and we've been able to make some great changes
and everyone has been on board with it,
but it really does take that full team of people.
But I don't think that would have happened.
And it's not that no one would'nt want it to happen, it's just,
we needed some type of facilitation to get the ball moving.
And that is what the accessible educational materials pilot
has done for Marietta City,
so we would definitely recommend it.
I think it's also great to build relationships with people
in the state and with the Centers For Accessible Material,
because it gives us more resources for our district
plus it gives us more research
that we can back our decisions with.
- (Luis) So to wrap things up Carson, I would love it
if you could tell us a little bit about a special initiative
you started in Georgia, Take A Minute,
so what is the goal of that initiative?
What do you hope to accomplish with it?
'cause it's a really exciting initiative.
- (Carson) Luis, I'm glad you asked. (chuckles)
We're really excited about this.
Our Take A Minute
is basically we're moving past compliance of just
checking a box for assistive technology
and accessible educational materials
in the special factors section of an IEP.
We're really looking at changing things
for students and having some,
some results that are based on our decisions
and our conversations at the IEP table, you know,
what we're asking is that IEP teams
just basically Take A Minute
and answer a few questions that we're providing.
Final question will be answered whether or not the student
needs assistive technology and AEM,
you can answer it yes, no or maybe, we don't know,
but we can find out.
So once that minute is over, each team member gets a,
I took a minute badge and they can wear that badge
throughout the day, throughout the building to help raise
awareness of what accessible educational materials are
and how they can help students level the playing field.
If they have difficulty accessing materials,
digital materials, having the technology
that they need to access their curriculum.
- (Luis) That is awesome!
and I can't wait people to be wearing those badges.
And like you said,
it will raise awareness and people will ask questions.
You know, "What are you taking a minute for?" (chuckles)
and hopefully that'll start a conversation
and really spread awareness, so look forward to that.
So Carson, would you be willing to come back later this year
and let us know how Take A Minute is going?
- (Luis) Absolutely, I'm very excited to share anything
that we have, and I really feel good about this.
And I think that we'll get some really good subjective
and objective data.
- (Luis) And sometimes that's the important thing
is as we roll the things out, get that data,
get that information, and then you can make adjustments.
So you've both used the phrase when we know better,
we do better, so it really that's the spirit,
I think, in which you are engaging in this work,
which is so important, that continuous improvement.
Well, thank you so much, Carson and Somer,
it was great to have you on the podcast.
And I look forward to, you know, reporting back on,
not just Take A Minute,
but how this partnership is going and how it's improving
the timely provision of accessible materials
and technologies for all students in Georgia.
(upbeat music)
Thanks for tuning into this episode of the Accessible
Learning Experience brought to you by the National Center
on Accessible Educational Materials at CAST.
You can find us on the web at aem.cast.org.
There you'll find show notes with links to all
of the resources mentioned on each episode.
Thanks again for listening.
And remember, accessibility is everyone's responsibility.
(upbeat music)
The contents of this podcast were developed under a
cooperative agreement with the U.S. Department Of Education.
However, those contents do not necessarily represent
the policy of the U.S. Department Of Education.
And you should not assume endorsement
by the federal government.